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Pogatetz_Ate_My_Hamster_ Posted on 09/10/2019 08:20
Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
 
”Middlesbrough chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked by recent run

'They see this as a short term pain for long term gain phase', writes Anthony Vickers“


If they aren’t worried about being 2 points above relegation to League One having just been totally outclassed by the likes of Sheffield Wednesday and Birmingham with much tougher games to come, then they’re even more incompetent then I’ve ever given them credit for.

Link: Not worried
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Edis_Pilf Posted on 09/10/2019 08:27

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
A pure non story.
Not one single quote.
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OnlyInAmerica Posted on 09/10/2019 09:19

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Its one of those Anthony Vickers thinks articles
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Corcaigh_the_Cat Posted on 09/10/2019 09:21

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
It will have the MFC stamp of approval.
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Cleveleyssmoggie Posted on 09/10/2019 09:21

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Isn’t it what most fans thought when the transfer window closed?
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littledick Posted on 09/10/2019 09:25

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
If Woodgate was the outstanding candidate for the job, who the fcuk else was on the list ?[sad]
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Ironops Posted on 09/10/2019 09:26

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
I think we expected decent football and a mid table finish - not this dog$hit
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glover_elbow Posted on 09/10/2019 09:31

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Wheres exactly the long term gain coming from. Weaker and weaker with each season from the top downwards sheer incompetence reigns
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FartingGnome Posted on 09/10/2019 09:33

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
At the mo I'd settle for "Patchy"
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Octo_Burger Posted on 09/10/2019 09:41

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Not even going to bother reading the latest article. It's the same drivel they've been pumping out all week. They are clearly in cahoots with the club.
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Foggysfplandiet3 Posted on 09/10/2019 09:43

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
If we we genuinely are in trouble in the New Year something may happen, otherwise get used to it.
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littledick Posted on 09/10/2019 09:51

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Foggy.......so things will be happening in the new year then...


We'll get 0 points in next 3 games if we perform like we have recently, then it's another 2 tough away games at QPR & Derby. Stoke will pick up points as they've been playing well, not like us.
Huddersfield have reasonable squad and manager, there's really only Barnsley who we can 'match' both on and off the pitch.
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BigmetsBoro86 Posted on 09/10/2019 09:54

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
I seriously don't understand why they would expect a patchy season (by patchy I presume they mean woeful[rle]?).

It's basically the squad that finished 7th and one point of the playoffs. We have only lost Braithwaite / Downing and Dimi. You can count the contributions of those 3 last season on 2 hands.

It's not like the squad has been designated or we have 10 new signings who need to bed in etc.

It's the same players that bored us to 7th. So I'm not having it they expected us to regress so much in such a short space of time? [sad]

Also its not like woody is a new manager who needs time to bed in and get to know his squads strengths. He's been in and around these lot for years.

I can take defeats if we can see what we are trying to achieve. The problem is the games against Brum and sheff wed were some of the worst half's of football I've seen in years.
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dragged_up_in_whinneybanks Posted on 09/10/2019 10:10

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Expecting a patchy season and being on the verge of a very difficult relegation fight are two totally different things. As has been said above, we are on the verge of being in the bottom three and Woodgate does not have the experience or ability to get us out of this situation. Gibbo has been having a mare in recent years, but this is serious. Was he expecting another Bruce Rioch or Stan Anderson revival. If so, it was another in a quite long line of poor decisions . We need to either appoint another manager or bring in support for Woodgate.
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Boro_Legend Posted on 09/10/2019 10:30

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
It was always going to be tough, but the longer we are getting result like we are, a change will have to be made.
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viv_andersons_nana Posted on 09/10/2019 10:32

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
It seemed like everybody was in agreement at the start of the season and was bracing themselves for a hard season of transition. People have lost their nerve way too early, IMO. There are some issues regarding style of play as it appears Woodgate has already sacrificed his approach for a more 'meat and potatoes' one but other than that this is sort of how it was likely to shape up.

The club said they wanted to change the style of play, have a style of play that runs right through the age groups/teams, look to promote youth and try to recruit more effectively/efficiently. They're not going to change their minds three months in. I think people need to be patient.

Lots of posters complained that the squad needed full backs and wide players(we did) - the club went and bought three of them but they're young players who need time to settle in and adjust to the step up in quality. They're the sort of players other clubs buy and lots of posters wonder why the Boro aren't in for them. You have to be patient.

It'll be hard work and probably difficult to watch at times. But so was last season. I'd rather the club outlined something and tried to make it work than appoint people like Pulis and waste a load of cash on players who just don't produce the goods. We've seen enough of that since we went up, surely.

Hold your nerve.
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TheFair86 Posted on 09/10/2019 10:35

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Lot of people held this view at the start of the season and, not for the first time, were called bedwetters on here. At what point will people wake up and realise that it's ok to be sceptical or worried about a club you support? In fact actually healthy...you don't need to just blindly support them.
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viv_andersons_nana Posted on 09/10/2019 11:02

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
There is nothing wrong with being sceptical or worried about Boro but at the same time I think it is unrealistic to not give a new regime more than three months before wondering if they should rip it up and start again.

Of course there are things to be concerned about, certainly on the pitch, but IMO it is too early to judge one way or the other.
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Cuthbert Posted on 09/10/2019 11:08

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Good posts v_a_n.
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Ironops Posted on 09/10/2019 11:10

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
I disagree that most peolle were expecting a long hard season. The noises from the club suggested we could expect attacking pressing football with an emphasis on scoring more goals.

Realistically we wanted a better style of play but understood we would not win every game, probably get punished on occassion but generally hold our own and finish mid table but play good football and entertain people

Its not turned out like that at all. We've been disjointed, disorganised, totally out played for long periods of matches, against bang average opposition and the general play has been worse than under Pulis at times.

As others have said, there bis a big gap between a patchy mid table season and the current position of seeming almost certain to be scrapping against relegation.

You can call people bedwetters and use meaningless phrases like 'hold your nerve' but the reality is that currently we are just not good enough, both on and off the pitch.
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coluka Posted on 09/10/2019 11:34

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
I expected a tough long hard season.
I expected the 2nd half to be slightly more prosperous than the first.
I expected a seasons of ups and downs.
I expected we would at least compete with the likes of Birmingham, Brentford, Blackburn and Barnsley.

Having witnessed performances slowly but surely worsening, confidence draining from the players, pressing getting less and less, hoofball re-appearing more and more, dropping deeper and deeper to defend, I expect us to be bottom of the league by 5pm on Saturday 26 October. [|)]

Maybe the teams coming up next will allow us to play our new high press and attacking style and we play our way to another 9 points looking like Barcelona, but somehow I think we will still be on 8 points, with the likes of Bausor, Bevington, Gill et al assuring Mr Gibson everything is fine, nothing to see here, all will be well soon enough and the team are set to fly.
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Pogatetz_Ate_My_Hamster_ Posted on 09/10/2019 11:35

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
This is worse than the seasons so many complained about under Pulis, on every measurable scale.

Even when we lost 6 in a row we played well in half those games but just couldn’t score.

It was obvious last season it was going to be Woodgate, but as much as I didn’t want him I was willing to give him 10 games to see what he could do.

I honestly think he hasn’t got a clue, I’ve never seen a manager so tactically inept.

Average opposition managers, managing average teams are seeing huge flaws in this team and Woodgate’s methods and he’s completely incapable of addressing those issues.

Sheff Wed play a direct game, we all knew that. When Fry and Shotton have demonstrated they can’t deal with an aerial threat previously you put Ayala in to deal with that. Monk doubled down and played both target men, we got battered. Ayala comes on at half time 1-4 down.

4-3-3 relies heavily on the full backs getting up and down the pitch providing the width and getting crosses into the box. This is as amateur level as tactics get, and yet he plays Ryan Shotton as a left back who doesn’t have the pace, the left foot or the crossing ability to help in the attack and kept drifting inside giving Birmingham free reign down our left.

The whole team was lopsided and totally disjointed. Meanwhile a left back he signed is sat on the bench.

I knew full well the vision that him and Gibson were selling of high pressing, high tempo, attacking football whilst having an inexperienced manager and cutting budgets was a deluded fantasy.

But what I simply don’t accept is how terrible we’ve performed - 2 wins, out of the cup at home to Crewe, haven’t scored more than one goal at home, not a single shot on goal at Cardiff, 1-4 down to Sheff Wed at half time, battered for 90 minutes by Birmingham.

Make no mistake this club is in crisis, and it’s entirely down to Steve Gibson.
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borofan402 Posted on 09/10/2019 11:37

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
So they expected a patchy season yet still charged one of the most expensive ST prices in the league?

Yep, sounds like our club alright.
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boro19 Posted on 09/10/2019 11:52

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
This is just club propaganda
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Funky_Chicken Posted on 09/10/2019 11:57

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
“Patchy” - is that code for the worst football seen here in decades and a relegation battle [8)]




🐔
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glover_elbow Posted on 09/10/2019 12:04

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
We new full well the vision that him and Gibson were selling of high pressing, high tempo, attacking football whilst having an inexperienced manager and cutting budgets was a deluded fantasy.

Exactly like the arsenal lite fantasy under southgate [rle]
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Ticker_Tape Posted on 09/10/2019 12:05

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Things had to change at the club from Karanka and Pulis, both managers played dour football that was always going to be bl00dy awful to watch( and it was) despite having good money to spend.

We have to build something and it may take time and it has to based on decent football to watch. Woodgate has the difficult task to get rid of some deadwood and bring young players in and through, as well as adding the right experience when Gibbo can spend FFP allowing.

I'm glad Gibbo has made it clear he's going nowhere and he's trying to do something different.
We know it won't be easy, and we will lose some good regular supporters along the way but that's life.
As for the accountants and sofa Firestick tossers,moaning and wanting to see Gibbo gone,it really doesn't concern you and he's done this before and proved the likes of you lot wrong.

UTB.
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Ironops Posted on 09/10/2019 12:11

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
He hasnt done it before though has he?

The last time we had a rookie manager trying to dismantled one side and rebuild another it was southgate, who got us relegated, while scoring 29 gaols in an entire season.

When we have been successful its been with a good coach like Mclaren and Aitor making a step up, or just throwing cash at it like Robbo did



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Vena Posted on 09/10/2019 12:11

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Clear the decks and and start again woody is in to oversee the ending of the contracts for the big earners (Next 2 years i think before most will leave to find their next victim) if we are still in this league then he'll still have his job and a chance to build on his teenage team,

if not its 2 consecutive promotion push like so many have had done probably with a new manger.

so half full is my glass im already thinking about promotion from league 1.
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JLinardi Posted on 09/10/2019 12:18

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
I don’t see what ‘holding your nerve’ has to do with anything, I’m not nervous more bored out of my mind, I’ve missed 2 home games and didn’t bother watching the last game on sky.

This isn’t patchy it’s just awful and we seem to have got worse, I don’t see any improvement or even any small things to look at and be optimistic about.

Like a few others said, I expected to show a certain level of fight as a minimum, create a few chances and maybe come out of some games (or even most games) thinking we were unlucky but gave it our best.

What I wasn’t expecting was a continuation of slow plodding football where we rarely test the keeper and look like we are playing at 80%.

Nothing about this club ever seems to change for the better, it’s always this dull slow decline where we make obviously poor decisions. I just can’t be bothered any more.
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otto42 Posted on 09/10/2019 12:20

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Patchy I can cope with but the shambles against Wednesday and Blues I can't!

I am coming to the conclusion that a novice manager isn't the right guy to implement a complete change, especially with a sqaud of senior players not equiped for 4-3-3. Perhaps not surprisingly it's the manager who has lost his nerve? Hardly surprising given the hand he has been dealt.

The only way forward for Woody, if they insist on this 4-3-3, is to use the players no matter how inexperienced best suited to do this. Also occassionaly you have to take account of the opposition unless you are City or Liverpool, which we aren't.

At the moment I am prepared to give Woody time to adapt and learn, but many more performances like the two mentioned above imho his position becomes untenable.
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The_Downing_Wave Posted on 09/10/2019 12:22

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
"And it has to be said, there is a feeling in the camp that the team are not as bad as the table suggests and but for a few marginal decisions - goals disallowed, penalties waved away - they would be comfortably better off."

That's how the article finishes and it's frightening.

In a few games we've arguably been a lot worse than the table suggests, it smacks of complacency.
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Ticker_Tape Posted on 09/10/2019 12:26

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Gibbo has Ironops and he will do it again, it's hard going for supporters.
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Indeedido Posted on 09/10/2019 12:31

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
We ended last season with a major transformation required.

On and off the pitch. But they are of course linked.

Woodgate was hired to transform things on the pitch. Given the size of the task, the reduced budget, smaller squad and having the same recruitment and Exec team to "help", it represents a massive challenge; impossible in the space of weeks.
I am not remotely surprised that this season has been so poor.
I personally don't think Woodgate was the man for such a job and still don't think he will be. However he was appointed and deserves some support; not least from the idiot who appointed him in such circumstances.

The biggest changes actually need making OFF the pitch.
Realistically if the owner/chairman is not going to be changed, then at least he has to change the way he operates and change the fundamentals at the Club that are the reasons why we have slumoed to the position we are now in and why the future looks quite grim.
Appoint a real Chief Exec and truly empower them. Step aside Gibson.
Let that Chief Exec appoint a team, including the people responsible for the football, from First team to Academy and Scouting/Recruitment excellence.
Go back to focusing on hauling toxic materials Gibson, because literally everything else you currently touch is struggling (MFC, Rockliffe Hall)
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Ironops Posted on 09/10/2019 12:37

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
He hasnt though Ticker Tape - Southagte was terrible for us

Mclaren was a coach under Fergy, Aitor was a coach under Mourinho, both had top level experience and were given funds. Aitor had the basis of a good squad that Mowbray had put together

Woodgate is in a similar position to Southagte but with far less resources to make the change - we need half a squad!

I dont totally blame him - he would clearly like to try other players and ways of playing but he doesnt even have a squad big enough and he doesnt have the nouse to get the best out of what he has
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wombledon Posted on 09/10/2019 12:39

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
When the club took 4 weeks to appoint Woodgate I knew what sort of season we were in for.

It was obvious at the time that they wanted to look like they were trying every angle. They wanted the fans to think they'd left no stone unturned.

It was clear as day they wanted Woodgate. All that charade to try pull the wool over the fans eyes was a complete waste of transfer window time.

The fact we ended the transfer window still short of wingers/attackers wasn't a surprise to many. The complete incompetence to recruit in certain positions has been evident for years.

All the talk after the appointment was about positivity, about promotion, about aiming for top 2. Fast, attacking and youthful football.

This is going to take time, agreed, but the messages have very quickly changed to "oh, well, we expected this, to be honest".

I do feel sorry for Woodgate, but he's also part of the problem. If you don't have the players to play a certain system - which for 433 we do not - then you need to adapt your philosophy.

We don't have a creative midfield 3 to select from. They're workman like, sure, but there's a lack of pace, flair and especially the eye for a pass.

Marvin Johnson is only out and out winger and I don't believe he's good enough for a promotion chasing team, which is want we allegedly want to be.

Our full backs potentially could fit the bill, but they're young and having a step-up from the league below. They need time. They're also not being helped by those in front of them.

I'm not overly concerned that this is actually a relegation battle yet, in October, but there's definitely some warning signs in the performances which certainly need addressing. And quickly.
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Ticker_Tape Posted on 09/10/2019 12:41

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
HSothgate did OK for a while though Ironops, it was when he lost the experience of Harrison and Round he fell short.
I feel Woody does need an experienced coach who works with the players day to day and also get rid of that fitness coach , as for me we do have a big fitness problem too.
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sheriff_john_bunnell Posted on 09/10/2019 12:44

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
What viv said with added you bunch of Fanny's.

You asked for a manager who would play attacking football. You got one.
As for not wanting Woodgate - who are the managers stupid enough to take on a club with a bunch of cloggers and no money to spend, where the locals are up in arms about defensive football, yet will call for a managers head in less than a dozen games when results aren't going their way. Some names to put in the hat please.
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boro8686 Posted on 09/10/2019 12:53

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Sherriff - Over half the championship managers I'd bet and pretty much all of those in league 1&2, Scotland and various European leagues.
How many clubs would have wanted Woodgate though?
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UgoAfro Posted on 09/10/2019 12:55

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
"We new full well the vision that him and Gibson were selling of high pressing, high tempo, attacking football whilst having an inexperienced manager and cutting budgets was a deluded fantasy."

"Exactly like the arsenal lite fantasy under southgate"

Completely agree with this. Both strategies are naive in the extreme and I can't believe the same chairman who went through similar with Southgate has gone down the same path again.
"
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Ticker_Tape Posted on 09/10/2019 13:00

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
It's hard going from only having the players to play 9 at the back and a sweeper to decent attacking football.

I hope Gibbo can draw on the experience of seeing a manager and players achieve promotion and then doing it again but then this time getting past the 6th round of the FA cup and on to its final and also reaching two FLC finals.
Start again and reach another FA cup SF, win our first ever cup silverware and then onto one of the one of best teams in Europe that season.
Start again and defend their way to promotion.

Start again, that's quite a bit of experience you have Gibbo, I'm proud of what you have achieved with our club and I'm sure that a Park End lad with only a college education is the envy of his neighbourhood.

Keep going son.
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Nero Posted on 09/10/2019 13:02

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
If by patchy they mean a season long battle with relegation then they're correct.

Boro at the moment look a shambles. How can a team so good at defending in recent years suddenly look like a school boy team. I don't get it.
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Indeedido Posted on 09/10/2019 13:32

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Nero - because the entire team was set up first not to concede under pulis.

Woodgate was trying to change the set up of the team first to score and win. It is a massive transformation.
Some of the players are simply not good enough to make the change and Woodgate has seen this.
He will have to adapt and mix it up to pragmatically survive, while the squad is eventually transformed.

It's a diametric change that is simply not possible in a few weeks.
Gibson is going nowhere, so we have to be patient.
Woodgate deserves our support whilst he tries to juggle some sharp knives.
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Ironops Posted on 09/10/2019 13:40
Edited On: 09/10/2019 13:41
Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
last season under Pulis was a wednesday night sausage and mash - not very exciting, a bit stodgy but ok - shame there was no dessert

this season we have been told to expect a ham salad - pleasant to look at, may be a bit lacking in filling but ultimately healthy and we may end up hungry for more

what we have so far been served up is a plate of cold sick
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Pogatetz_Ate_My_Hamster_ Posted on 09/10/2019 13:52

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
“ You asked for a manager who would play attacking football. You got one.”

I think it’s well established by now I was one of a tiny minority that didn’t, as this squad wasn’t capable of playing that way and wouldn’t get the money to make it work.

“As for not wanting Woodgate - who are the managers stupid enough to take on a club with a bunch of cloggers and no money to spend, where the locals are up in arms about defensive football, yet will call for a managers head in less than a dozen games when results aren't going their way. Some names to put in the hat please.”

Gary Rowett, Paul Clement, Nigel Adkins, Nigel Pearson.

None of them would have cost big money, all better than the idiot we’ve currently got. But Gibson only wants to surround himself with yes men and sycophants.
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Pogatetz_Ate_My_Hamster_ Posted on 09/10/2019 13:56
Edited On: 09/10/2019 13:59
Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
“Nero - because the entire team was set up first not to concede under pulis.

Woodgate was trying to change the set up of the team first to score and win. It is a massive transformation”

You could accept that if we were better going forward but defensively suspect (as we were on the opening day).

But that isn’t the case, we’re worse going forward than we were under Pulis and we’re far worse at the back. We’re worse all over the pitch.
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Marvanelli Posted on 09/10/2019 13:57

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Totally agree with Viv's post.
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UpTheBoro70 Posted on 09/10/2019 14:13

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Off on tangent here but, anybody know who new scout is after it was advertised not long back?
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Aqualung Posted on 09/10/2019 14:16

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
The world according to the evening Gazette

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Nero Posted on 09/10/2019 14:32

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
It's not that often I agree with Pog but he's spot on here.

We could accept Woodgate's so called transformation if we looked good attacking. We don't though. We look like a team with no shape, idea or plan. Added to that is the fact we're horrendous defensively and cannot defend simple crosses into the box.

Surely the team must train during the week on team shape. It's a XXXXXX simple part of the game but one if not done right has massive consequences. Team shape was the Pulis strong point. All the player knew exactly what was expected.
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Ticker_Tape Posted on 09/10/2019 14:51

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Look no further than Indeedios post, thats the top and bottom of it.

I know things can get worse but we have to start somewhere.
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wilkos_perm Posted on 09/10/2019 14:55

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Whilst I agree to some extent Ticker, when you say we have to start somewhere, why does that place have to be with a total novice in charge?

What sensible reasoning would there be to suggest he's the best equipped person to deal with the current situation? It would be hard enough for someone more experienced.
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Boro_Legend Posted on 09/10/2019 15:06

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Just the news that was given to me about Woodgate staying put [:I][:I][:I][}:)][}:)]
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Pogatetz_Ate_My_Hamster_ Posted on 09/10/2019 15:08

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Exactly, in what other line of business would somebody with zero managerial experience be asked to oversee a change in strategy at the same time as cutting costs in a competitive multi-million pound industry?
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Ticker_Tape Posted on 09/10/2019 15:10
Edited On: 09/10/2019 15:11
Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Theres an agument for that Wilko,and I cant see that theres a not lot wrong with your thoughts on that. Not you,however I do despair at those that think Gibbo has no idea and should go. Especilally to those sat 400 miles away and really couldnt be in the same breath as Gibbo or supporters that back the club financially.

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Ticker_Tape Posted on 09/10/2019 15:17

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Well its a bit hit and miss Pog, Karanka bored me to death (rookie), at times Mowbray in molasses did too (experienced) Strachan lost the plot(experienced) and Pulis was the dullest football (trademark).

Its a bit of a lottery, so unless he becomes a bully and the players revolt and we lose every week, he will learn with any luck.

You couldnt say any manager will step in and do the business, Warnock, could get us up but would have to leave straight after.
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1finny Posted on 09/10/2019 15:22

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Pog - agree
Always makes me wonder what happens to great businessmen when they go into football.

Imagine Bulkhaul needed a major overhaul and change of direction. There is no way he’d take a risk with a rookie.
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Ticker_Tape Posted on 09/10/2019 15:31

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
The bloke who took over is a former professional footballer, so not a rookie.

Theres no such thing as a experienced manager from the off. However other businesses use people who dont know their ar$e from their elbow in that particular trade, and it shows and they go bust.

We are know the world over to have the poorest industrial and manufacturing/retail management... easy to say isnt it.
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Pogatetz_Ate_My_Hamster_ Posted on 09/10/2019 15:35

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
I’ve been told a number of times over the years by someone who worked with both of them that it was Michael O’Neil who was the real business man of the two, and Steve was very much the secondary man.

I always dismissed it as rubbish, but I believe it now.

Based on what I’ve seen at Middlesbrough FC, I have no idea how Steve Gibson has ever made money in buisness.
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YouwantsomeYougotnofans Posted on 09/10/2019 15:39

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Lol... Is it same person that told you about Guus Hiddink then BL? [:D]
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wilkos_perm Posted on 09/10/2019 15:39

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Ticker whilst I agree that it's hit and miss with managerial appointments, it's about minimizing the risk surely?

Karanka wasn't a rookie in the true sense. He'd at least coached the Spanish youth teams and Real Madrid,. Personally I didn't find us boring in the championship for me it was far and away the most enjoyable seasons in a long time. But that's digressing.
I don't think Pulis is a fair example either as everyone knows the type of football he plays.
There are proven managers, say Pearson for example, who, whilst not perfect have successfully played attacking football in this league, albeit with better players who for me would've been better suited to the job.

I have nothing against Gibson and certainly don't want him out, but his managerial appointments have swung wildly recently and it's a terrible model to follow. How can you go from appointing Pulis (lots of experience and very negative) to 18 months later thinking the total opposite is the best option?
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Cuthbert Posted on 09/10/2019 15:58

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Vena - "so half full is my glass im already thinking about promotion from league 1".

I'm not saying I want us to go down. Of course I don't. Just that others have gone that way and come back stronger.
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Ticker_Tape Posted on 09/10/2019 16:07

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked

Perhaps wilko, but the best laid plans sometimes fall apart.

Karanka,may have issues as he was moved on sharpish and Im not sure what hes doing now tbh.
Pearson has baggage as do most who will just saunter away should a better offer come in.
Granted it may not work out, but he needs a little time, and especially the January to move people on.
He maybe needs to sign an out of contract player, and the pros at the club may buck their ideas up after listening to what its like to be adrift from the game.

Woody seems to act on fairness and merit, the players need to do the same with him.
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sheriff_john_bunnell Posted on 09/10/2019 16:09

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
I do not believe that any of the mediocre managers people have named would want to come here. Let's be clear the remit is as follows.

1. Play attractive attacking football.
2. Win football matches.

Switch those two priorities round and you'll get a few people interested.

The team has no shape because they have from day one been working on attack. That is a remit which comes direct from the mouths of those whining about the football being boring under Karanka. What are we 10 games in and already you're all on about learning how to defend again.

Gibson's no idiot. He knows we are more likely to have success playing in a more pragmatic fashion. He knows after a few weeks of this you'll all welcome Sam allardyce with open arms.

Attacking football
Cloggers
No money
Fans will bottle it after 5 weeks.

You would have to be a mug.

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Pogatetz_Ate_My_Hamster_ Posted on 09/10/2019 16:31

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
“ I do not believe that any of the mediocre managers people have named would want to come here. ”

Clement worked under this conditions at Reading
Rowett worked under those conditions at Birmingham
Pearson openly stated he wanted the job

Doesn’t that tell you something if what you are saying was true, that through years of mismanagement and neglect the best manager we could attract based on the hand Steve Gibson could deal the new manager was Jonathan Woodgate?

I don’t believe that for a second.

This is about:

1) a misguided fantasy of a local manager and local players playing attacking football
2) having a manager who can be controlled and won’t want to overhaul the behind the scenes structure was has failed over and over again.

This is nothing to do with holding nerves, if we were midtable playing decent stuff but getting beat every other week that would be expected. But we’re not, we’re taking poundings from bog standard Championship clubs and look awful in every area of the pitch.
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wilkos_perm Posted on 09/10/2019 16:36

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
I was just giving Pearson as an example. I accept your point that the most logical looking plans can fail however I just find it hard to believe that the best possible candidate for the job, within budget, just happened to be already at the club and from the area. It seems like an incredibly small time mentality.
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sheriff_john_bunnell Posted on 09/10/2019 16:42

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
I don't believe any of the managers you mentioned pog were working under the conditions of attacking football being the be all and end all.

And I'm not talking about the likes of yourself holding their nerve. You were moaning about Karanka, not because you felt the football was poor, but because you felt he was a poor manager full stop.

I think that those who do want attacking football full stop and those who have moaned about the style of play when we have been successful are those we should be hearing from now. Just as they should have been offering their support to monk.
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Ticker_Tape Posted on 09/10/2019 17:01

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Could it be trust Wilco?

Especially as Monk may have broken his trust in people?
Better the devil you know.
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littledick Posted on 09/10/2019 17:33

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
At woodys unveiling, SG when asked by the media, said he'd be backing the manager financially, as he always had.


Having a laugh [:D]
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Richyboro Posted on 09/10/2019 17:38

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Won't be long before Gibbo gives the Gazette the green light to do a hatchet job on Woody. Like they did on AK when Gibbo okayed it.
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JLinardi Posted on 09/10/2019 19:06

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
This ‘attacking football’ thing is starting to do my head in now, as usual with us it has to be took to the extreme.

Take Pearson for example, Leicester’s goal tally was nothing to be sniffed at when he got them promoted, they were in a very similar position to us now when he took over. Yes he may not be klopp but his teams still attacked but it came from a solid foundation.

Attacking isn’t just about getting as many men forward as possible, it’s a game of strategy, knowing how to break teams down, where to position players and when to bring them into the game.

We made this exact mistake after relegation, oh karankas gone we want attacking football, let’s rip it all up. No, we didn’t need to do that, all we had to do was use what karanka had set up and maybe tweak the balance a bit, why would you tear up a record breaking defence and shape that even did wel in the premiership, our goals conceded was very respectable for a relegated team.

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hopesoboro Posted on 09/10/2019 19:09

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Pog,you need to be concentrating on your young family instead of wasting your time whingeing on a message board!
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Pogatetz_Ate_My_Hamster_ Posted on 09/10/2019 19:18

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
That’s the key word Jlinardi, balance[^]
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JLinardi Posted on 09/10/2019 20:15

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
And something we’ve never really managed to find, even in the promotion season our attack wasn’t great.
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hicktonpen10 Posted on 09/10/2019 21:53

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
I have utterly rejected this narrative from day one. Don't ever remember the club stating this as their aim and it has been spun mercilessly by Gazette and the fools on Tees. The golden thread narrative is also utter bilge and the football we are watching is indistinguishable from the TP era.
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parmoboy Posted on 09/10/2019 23:03

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
"oh karankas gone we want attacking football, let’s rip it all up. No, we didn’t need to do that, all we had to do was use what karanka had set up and maybe tweak the balance a bit"

I agree with this. I think a big reason why we were still able to get the goal(s) needed to win us games under Karanka was because until the Premier League season, he almost always had a creative no 10 in his sides.

Fabbrini, Tomlin and Ramirez were all players who had the ability to produce a moment of magic out of nothing, and generally tried to be positive whenever they were on the ball.

If you think about it, we haven't had a proper no 10 at the club since Karanka left. Closest we came was with Braithwaite, but then Pulis played him on the left wing, and of course reality is he didn't want to be here.

We had a brilliant shape under Karanka, the entire team was well drilled but we also had players who could do it at the other end of the field when they got their chances.
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Boro_Legend Posted on 09/10/2019 23:04

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Steve Gibson has to speak out him self. I dont know where they got this story from today.
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JLinardi Posted on 09/10/2019 23:08

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
I agree that imo was the problem with karankas system, the forwards were quite lonely so had to be special enough to make things happen themselves. I don’t think other than Gaston we managed to ever get anyone in who was good enough to be a forward in that system.

As for 433 I don’t think it will ever work here, firstly because none of our midfielders seem to be able to attack and 2nd our recruitment of midfielders and wide players is nothing short of shocking.
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parmoboy Posted on 09/10/2019 23:15

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
I know we both agree that one of Monks' biggest mistakes was not making Bamford his main striker, but another big mistake was not signing a no 10 to replace replace Ramirez.

Imagine if instead of signing Britt and Braithwaite, he'd have instead used the £24m to sign a left winger and a no 10.

If he'd have then had Traore on the right and Bamford up front, we would have potentially had one hell of a frontline.
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JLinardi Posted on 09/10/2019 23:45

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Monk went for the 433 aswell though didnt he? But yeah its a bit unbelievable what we could have spent in our wide positions that season.
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parmoboy Posted on 09/10/2019 23:53

Boro chiefs expected patchy season & won't be spooked
Yeah, at the start of the season he did. I remember for a brief peiod we actually went 4-2-3-1, with Braithwaite playing off Britt and Tav and Downing on the wings and it coincided with our best run of form under Monk.
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